Psychological Safety
I got to know Dr. Allessandria Polizzi whom we call Al through a friend of mine who was on a previous podcast, Quincy Troupe, and was struck immediately by Dr. Polizzi’s intelligence, creativity, sense of humor and couldn’t wait to get our discussion out to all of you.
Verdant Consulting: an award-winning organization
Dr. Polizzi is the CEO of Verdant Consulting who focuses on building resiliency skills and psychological safety in the workplace.
I started this company back in 2021. My tenure really has been on the HR Leadership development side for a wide variety of multi-national organizations.
I think your organization has won some awards recently?
Yes. Our company focuses on teaching individuals, teams and leaders specific skills, accompanied by an app that has microlearning and mindfulness exercises that are actionable and no longer than 90 seconds. We do this through 60+ affiliates around the globe across every industry and almost every time zone who can support and deliver that training.
We are pretty unique in that we are focused on proactively building skills vs. reacting when we’re in times of crisis. We’ve been recognized in the industry as being in the
· Top 20 workplace wellness providers among companies like WebMD and VirginPulse.
· Top 10 change management providers
· Top professional stress reduction provider based on the skills we teach to prevent burnout.
What can we DO to avoid burnout?
This is a podcast about collaboration. Your field is related but different. When I think of you, I think of stress. What you do is in the field of mental health. In our first conversation you said, “who’s paying attention to all the stress out there? A lot of people are paying attention and writing about it out there, but who is doing something about it?” You were a senior HR person, and you’ve only been at it a couple of years.
Early 2021 I realized I was in burnout, I was informed by my family. I looked for help but I wasn’t able to find anything that I thought would be useful. It was all opinion-based or somebody read a book somewhere, or some random person overcame burnout and now they were going to spread the good news.
A lot of people referred me to a yoga retreat center, but I was not looking for a spiritual awakening. I was just looking to feel better and not spend every night crying in the bathtub. So, I decided to take time off to recover. Part of my recovery was researching.
I started logging into my daughter’s college and researching scholarly articles and peer-reviewed studies on stress at work, burnout recovery and burnout causes. That took me down a rabbit hole. Very quickly, Carlos, I noticed a consistency in tactics that were known to work that we never talked about in the workplace. I found tons of research. Tons. Tons!
Why aren’t we seeing the answer to avoiding burnout?
Any reason why we weren’t seeing that research applied in productive ways before?
My hypothesis was
1. Academia makes things really confusing by not using everyday words
2. I had to log in as my daughter to access this information which is not freely made available to the world.
She’s going to graduate this spring and I actually thought, “How am I going to get access to all this great data? Maybe I need to take a class or something so I can have access to it.” It’s hidden in the miasma of academia. It’s hard to get access to it, to translate it into everyday words.
Here’s an example of one that really hit home for me. I did it on my podcast a lot.
In 1993 there was an article written on burnout In HR.
That was 30 years ago! Yet when did we start talking about burnout in HR? Maybe recently? So for 30 years it’s been well known, well documented, study after study after study on burnout, compassion fatigue, toxin handling all these things in HR that we never talked about.
To me, that was a big gap. My goal is to take the latest information around building resiliency skills, because I believe that is THE competency for today’s workforce, and to educate people on what has been scientifically proven to actually work.
Mindfulness: Data reveals alignment on this solution
You mentioned that in all these articles there was a surprising amount of consistency…
Oh yes. One of them I absolutely hate because I hate meditating and I did not want mindfulness to be a big thing, but gosh darn it, it was a big thing. Mindfulness is a great example. We hear it everywhere, some of us are over it, but the consistency in the data is overwhelming. I’m terrible at it.
I must confess, I’m big into mindfulness, so Yeah for my team!
Yes! So I had to figure out a way to incorporate that pragmatically. We don’t teach meditation, we teach mindfulness. Again, what I’ve learned through the research, thousands of articles that I’ve read, is to observe your thoughts and feelings in the moment. One of the things that really stuck with me is that the Chinese character is “heart” and “now”, the present. So, if I’m listening to how I’m feeling, thinking, responding, just that pause can enable me, with curiosity and withholding judgement, to bounce back differently than I could in a reactive mode.
So interesting. I did a retreat over the weekend and there was a guy who didn’t like to meditate-
Hate it.
-but I love the way you just expressed it. I’ll have to be sure to send him this podcast episode!
Self-Compassion
So Mindfulness. What else?
OK, here’s another one that’s going to sound touchy-feely but it’s not: Self Compassion.
That was an epiphany for me and made me want to do this work: If I could have every leader learn how to practice self-coaching instead of self-criticism, we could change the world. As leaders, there is tons of research on the loneliness, the stressors of being a leader, ways in which we bring our own biases to the workplace. If, instead of self-criticism and negative self-talk, I focused on speaking to myself with kindness, I change the structure of my brain and how I respond to challenges. I am better able to support others. I have more citizenship behaviors which is caring about the people around me when I practice self-compassion.
The first two you’ve mentioned are self-centered. About a year and a half ago I’d had it with psychological safety. All these people saying, “See, I have to feel safe. If I don’t feel safe at work, work must be a terrible place.” I’d read extensively on it, even spoke to Professor Amy Edmonson at one point. But my manager may never be capable of creating a psychologically safe space: I’ve got to start with me. I’ve got to carry my own little Psychological Safety Kit wherever I go so that whenever I get into a situation where I don’t feel psychologically safe, where I can speak up and not suffer retribution for it, I’ll have a toolkit.
Start with yourself to establish psychological safety
I couldn’t find anything written about the me side of psychological safety. Every article said, “Dear manager, dear executive, this is how you need to behave to create it.” What you’re telling me now is what I’ve got to do.
That’s it exactly. When we focus on leadership development, we talk at leaders: you should be compassionate; you should be vulnerable; you should be authentic. Ok, how? How do I do that and also attend to my needs, listen to my boundaries, listen to myself because I am still a human being. I don’t shed my human needs with the promotion. That’s what I focus on a lot. The number one thing I recommend is start with you.
Let me talk about psychological safety because I was an eye-roller until recently. That was just another mamby-pamby feel-goodery. But there’s tons of scientific research about what it actually is.
· The World Health Organization just came out with their Mental Health At Work Policy and Guidelines
· The ISO came out with theirs in 2021
· There are national health guidelines and requirements that look at psychological health and safety as the same as physical health and safety because of the data shows how the negative impact affects the survival rate of our employees, the cost of healthcare and the performance of our business.
Why should an organization bother to foster psychological safety?
One study showed that high stress workplaces that really put that pressure on have a 1.5 times more likelihood of going bankrupt.
Even OSHA (the Occupational Health and Safety Association), not the most touchy-feely, yoga-retreaty organization, says that about 30% of muscle strains, which is our biggest cost in health and safety, are due to the lack of psychological safety. So, “my backache from picking up that heavy lifting comes from not asking for help. “I didn’t want to look like a ___________ for not wearing my PPE (Personal Protective Equipment) because my boss isn’t wearing it,” it goes on and on and on. There’s tons, tons of research on the financial impact of having a psychologically unsafe workplace.
It felt like a fool’s errand trying to get my manager to be better at it.
How does psychological safety enhance collaboration?
Let’s talk about collaboration, though. How do I collaborate with others? By starting with me. What do I bring to the party? Then, if everyone is understanding their own biases and what they’re projecting on the world with their stress responses, then they’re much more able to operate in a collaborative way.
The other thing about psychological safety and collaboration is you’ve got friction of ideas without it being about the person.
I just listened to a TedTalk, and this fellow’s key to successful collaboration was non-defensiveness because defensiveness takes the different point of view and turns it into a conflict. It’s certainly a valuable contributor. This self-awareness, self-knowledge, self-management is critical to so many things.
I have this picture in my head of you, Al, reading all these articles and seeing all these nuggets pop out that are in 5 or 10 articles. Are there any other golden nuggets that you saw across the research?
YMCA
Yes. YMCA is Yourself, mindfulness, compassion and acceptance. In some circles it’s called tragic optimism – a term I hate but it’s measured through acceptance, but basically it’s like AA’s 12-step program: identifying the things you can control, the things you can’t, and the wisdom to know the difference. And letting go of the things we can’t control which includes other people’s opinions of us is a huge differentiator in how we weather through a highly traumatic and stressful event.
A colleague of mine once said, “What you think of me is none of my business.”
That’s Rue Paul! Rue Paul said that!
Oh, really? That’s the first time anyone has mentioned Rue Paul on my podcast.
He just upleveled on the cool factor!
Now I just need to do more TikToks like you!
So, acceptance, another self-centric tool about who I am and how I think about and talk to myself.
Yes, it’s about recognizing what you can and can’t control. If I spend a lot of time trying to control other’s opinions of me, how others see me, the decisions others make, that’s exhausting and really unfruitful.
What outward-focused advice do you have?
Were there any of these nuggets that were not about me and my relationship with myself?
There’s a lot of research on the impact that leaders have. There’s a ton of research on psycho-social hazards and risks, so let’s talk about that.
The WHO’s Mental Health Guidelines as well as the ISO’s 45003 focus a lot on psycho-social hazards and risks. Things like:
· Organizational Design
· Communication
· Feedback mechanisms
· Workload
Basically the processes and structures in your organization that would accelerate burnout and/or impact the ability of people to be psychologically safe. That’s the foundation. To me, it’s 2 sides to the same coin.
If I have a psychologically safe place to work and people are bringing their baggage, their trauma to work, we’re going to find ways to muck it up.
If I have all the skills in the world to navigate through whatever is happening to me, but I have structures and processes that undermine the ability for that to be successful, then it’s also going to be a struggle. So it really is both sides that need to be evaluated and understood.
Workplace stress: a global pandemic
Does that mean that stress in the workplace, lack of psychological safety is a global pandemic?
It absolutely is. It’s called the Second Pandemic. A little bit of trivia: the biggest threat to mental health is Climate Change. What we’ve experienced so far is just the beginning, unfortunately.
We don’t give ourselves enough credit for the stressors that we deal with. People say, “well that’s outside the workplace,” but we still have the same brain. We don’t get to swap it out for one that’s all clean and shiny. We’re bringing in the same brain that comes with all of our past experiences, the stressors outside of work, but then also a lot of the dysfunction that happens inside of work.
The WHO has just released, in concert with the ILO, the International Labor Organization, guidelines on creating a healthy and psychologically safe workplace that talks about three things:
1. Preventive measures, i.e., the psychological hazards and risks we talked about
2. Educating managers and individuals, what we at Verdant Consulting does
3. Supporting people in crisis
This isn’t just about mental illness; it’s about supporting the psychological health of the organization so that you can achieve your goals and people can thrive.
A recent CNN poll showed a surprising amount of unity…
Yes, a recent poll from KFF that was published on CNN, New York Times shows that 90% of the US feels we have a mental health crisis. Data nerd that I am, I looked that up. One of the things they asked about was the optimism and pessimism about the future, about our country and about our world or climate.
· About the future, we’re feeling aces: 70% positive
· About our county, 50% were feeling pessimistic
· About our planet, 50% were feeling pessimistic.
Those last 2 things are really hitting hard for us in the US.
Actionable Recommendations – What can I do?
Before I leave your office feeling depressed about those last 2 things, Dr. Polizzi, please tell me what I can do.
The first thing is to identify what you can and can’t control. The other thing is, and this was consistent, be really clear about your values and your goals. What’s important to you? Where do you want to be? Where are you headed? What is your true north? Getting grounded on what’s important gives you context on what you need to focus on and what things you can just leg go.
Can I be honest? I feel like I know that stuff and I’m still bummed.
Part of acceptance is accepting that “I feel bad about that stuff.” That’s a natural response. It makes sense that I feel the way I feel. Speak to myself with kindness, practicing self-compassion, and take a breath.
YMCA: Understanding Yourself, practicing Mindfulness, checking in on yourself with self-Compassion, and Acceptance of the things you can and can’t control.
Victims and those who blame others for problems
Those individuals who want to blame; who find their power pointing their finger at those who are making these bad things happen, whether it’s their boss or the oil company. “If only SHE would do THIS things would all be better.” What advice do you have for someone stuck in that place to get out of it?
I’m going to go back to what I just talked about.
1. I’m going to accept that person is going to be that way and there’s nothing I can do to change it.
2. I can make my boundaries clear and be really clear about what my values are, and then I have to let go of how I think they should behave.
3. Talk to myself with self-compassion. “Boy, that was tough. How am I doing? What do I need? Let’s figure out a way to move forward.”
Once we can accept that people show us who they are, we can find tactics on how to work with people that are that way that still aligns with my values and my boundaries.
I wish I could say to the blamers, “you need to find a way to be less angry. You’re carrying a load of anger at those who you judge to have done you wrong. Is there some way to help you liberate yourself?” and I know that’s outside of my control…
You can stop being angry at people when you can accept them for who they are. The anger is really, “Why are they not changing?”
That stuff kills you.
It absolutely does because you keep wanting to be something that they’re not. Some of us feel like it’s our fault. “If only I said the right thing, did the right thing, showed up the right way…” We turn it inward. Self compassion: you don’t own other people’s behavior towards you, their belief in who you are, that is theirs. So getting comfortable with letting go is not easy. The best thing you can do is accept that it is hard. You’re going to struggle, but this is something that will work for you in the long run. Back to the individual’s locust of control. That’s what the data shows.
Are productive workplace relationships necessary for productivity?
My theory of mental health and collaboration is that productive workplace relationships are fundamental to mental health at work. If my collaborative chops are good I can prevent stress and feel more fulfilled. What does your tell you about my never-researched hunch about that?
Yes. There are behaviors like citizenship behaviors, which is really about collaborating and sharing ideas. One study I read said that 70% of people would not share an idea that would make the business do better. Nor would they identify or raise their hand about a problem.
We can fill in the blank about why:
· Fear of repercussion
· Fear of career-limiting moves
· Fear of being ridiculed
Fear, fear, fear, fear, fear. And that’s what psychological safety means.
And if I’m not going to share my collaborative ideas, I’m not going to build productive collaborative relationships because that’s all about communicating and sharing…
And giving feedback, and bouncing ideas, and the collective being more than the separate. Collaboration is about teaming together. If I’m withholding information, afraid to share my opinion, have conversations in the shadows, we are not moving that forward, we’re undermining that.
Should we hire Verdant Consulting to take care of the problems so management doesn’t have to?
Let’s imagine a relatively large organization accountable only to itself and not very compassionate or kind, just out for the bucks, and therefore abusing people. I’m going to look at your organization and think, “you know what I love about this? They’re not going to make me accountable. They’ll work with my people, make them figure out how to deal with all the crap I’m throwing at them every day: I’m hiring her for sure!”
And I would pass on that because without support from the top none of this will stick. I’ll gladly take your money, let me be clear. You’ll be hiring me back because this will not work.
You have to really look holistically at the business. However, if you want to start by giving people the skills to navigate challenges, that’s a nice way to start. It’s a relatively easy lift. It’s something you don’t have to mandate. You can just say, “Hey, we’re aware of the ongoing pandemic around mental health. We want to equip people with skills to navigate challenges.” But if you do that and then continue to treat people like garbage, it looks like you’re excusing bad behavior. You’re making that part of your brand. And I don’t think anybody in this talent market wants that to be their brand.
What I’m looking for are companies that want to be at the forefront of this movement that is coming. The World Health Organization, ISO, ILO – this IS coming. The UK, Mexico, Canada, Australia – they’re ahead of us in all of this. Do you want to be on the back end of it or the front end of it? I look for organizations that want to be at the front end of differentiating themselves as employers of choice. In 2023 we are looking at certifying organizations as being psychologically safe based on these guidelines so that they can demonstrate both to their current and future employees that they’re committed to providing both a healthy and productive workplace.
Visit Dr. Al Polizzi’s company website, www.VerdantConsulting.com and look into becoming an affiliate or client of theirs and make your organization a certifiably psychologically safe and productive workplace.
WHO Guidelines on Mental Health
ISO Mental Health at work
US Surgeon General New Framework for Mental Health & Well-Being in the Workplace