Leading Teams with Dignity and Respect
Whatever it is, the way you tell your story online can make all the difference.
Juliana Saretta, who I knew when we were both at Mars, Inc, has been leading teams for years. Juliana is now Supply Chain and Procurement Leader at Keurig Dr Pepper. She’s one of those leaders with an instinct for leading groups or teams who is always interested in doing the best she can for the team. Team development is innate to her. In this episode/blogpost, Juliana discusses leading with dignity and respect. We’ll start with Juliana’s description of herself. Welcome, Juliana.
As my name indicates, Juliana Saretta, I’m of italian descent, born in Brazil, and have developed my career through different places, literally: geographies. I started working in procurement, my profession of choice back in my native Brazil where I joined Mars. I moved around. I was in Argentina for some years, then moved to the US where I spent most of my career working across different segments, also adding responsibilities along the way. I spent about half of my career in procurement and the other half in integrated end-to-end supply chain. I left Mars a couple of years ago and I’m now working at Keurig Dr. Pepper leading a portion of the procurement portfolio since it merged in 2018.
You mentioned segments: what products or brands did you have experience with?
When I was at Mars, I started in Petcare. That was the largest segment in Latin America. Brands like Pedigree and Whiskas were the biggest ones back in my time. I worked in confections with m&ms, Snickers, Skittles, those iconic brands when I moved to the US. I also worked in Mars Food with the iconic Uncle Ben’s brand. My last assignment with Mars was in the coffee business which was sold to Lavazza at about the time I left the Mars business. Now, with Keurig Dr. Pepper, I’m back in the coffee and soft drink business.
Some big brands that people use and know about?
Absolutely. That has been a source of pride for me. Something that I always try to remind people of: how important it is to feel a connection with the brand you represent, that you contribute to. I think that makes the work more enjoyable when you think that way.
Leading the first team
Absolutely. You remember the first significant team you led, right?
Yeah, it was in a moment of personal change for me when I relocated from my native Brazil to the neighboring country of Argentina. That’s when I moved from individual contributor to team leader. I was transferred there to establish the procurement function for what was at the time a developing business unit for Mars - the Southern Cone.
I love that name - the Southern Cone. Can you explain what the “Cone” is?
Yeah, I think it was just a visual of South America which has many countries in it, and there’s this cone on the bottom of it that is Chile, which is a very lengthy country, Argentina, Uruguay, Paraguay and that slice which is very distinct from big Brazil and the north part of South America. The cone just describes the shape of those countries.
So, there you are, you find yourself in Argentina leading a procurement team, was it?
Yes, because Mars used to serve those markets in the Southern Cone through factories and distribution companies that were somewhat outside of the region. At that point it was starting to manufacture products in Argentina. It was the entry point to what became a very established business unit in those countries, multiple factories since being installed there, Mars actually taking charge of distribution. It was the creation of the total business unit for Mars and the procurement function had to be developed. That was my assignment.
Learning from the hard times
What was hardest for you? Where did you struggle?
It’s great to see the same struggle as other people go through that first job as a team leader because it gives me a chance to revisit my experience and advise people. I think what I struggled with is what many people struggle with as they first step into the role of leading vs doing. It was that very fact of having built some success as an individual contributor, having a certain approach to my work that I knew worked, was successful, and how do I move from doing it all myself or at least believing it should be done my way to creating the space for people to do it their way. And also to realize that in that line to develop an opportunity for them. How do you move from doing work yourself or at least imposing your views to doing work through others and enabling their views? That was the very first moment of truth for me: to reconcile all that.
Hesitation can fester: learn to decide faster
We as adults learn by doing. We learn from our success and our mistakes. Do you remember one or two particular “learning moments” from that experience?
It wasn’t easy. It was not like I was cut out and naturally started leading and making wonderful strides with a team that was following me. It was actually far from it. I was very conflicted in that transition. Also, considering personal elements, I was moving to a new country where I didn’t know the language. So there’s lots of factors as the business of Mars entrusted me with that team. I inherited a group. There was a group of people doing the work of establishing that factory, which was the very first task. When I got there, the factory was built and starting to produce, and it was about assessing the talent and taking the agenda forward, establishing policies and creating the frameworks that would sustain the functions going forward.
I was coming from a little more mature business unit which was Mars in Brazil. By no means was it perfect. It was still a developing market for Mars at the time. So you think you know what a good team performance looks like and you look at the talent. I think that was one of the first learnings. I kept looking at the talent and thinking, it’s not exactly what I need but do I need a star in every seat? Do I need to replace all these people? Because I don't know if I can, and how do I do the work if I don’t have anybody to do the work? Do I do it myself?
It was very turbulent because the lesson or mistake in all of that was that it paralyzed me. I had all these different perspectives of what I thought good should look like, the sheer reality of what I had, the talent in the seats. I didn’t feel that I had the caliber that I needed. I didn’t have enough experience to get to that conclusion quickly and act on it.
Talk about a story, yes, I sat and contemplated for a little too long. I remember all this convergence of factors from what was going on in my personal life with that move, to the expectations the business had of me, to my previous success doing certain things, to what good looked like in my eyes, to the realities of the situation with the team I had. And as I contemplated and I kept wondering, of the people and the process, who do I retain? Who do I replace?
A long time went by, and then I learned by fire once the results started derailing and all of a sudden I was forced to action. You’ve got to be way more proficient in assessing those situations, the talent situation, the talent pool early.
Talent: the first focus for a new team
You asked what you do when you start a team, when you inherit a team, and that is the first thing you should do: get a pulse in the team of the talent.
As a brand new leader and, again, I’ve seen people come to me with those questions before, you start hesitating. “Oh, I could do better here. But if I replace this person then I have to invest the time on that replacement. Maybe I just muscle along a little longer and I can fill in the gaps myself” Those are the traps that I think I was a victim of: my own traps. I carried on contemplating, muscling along, and probably doing more myself than I should have done vs. creating my own burning platform to just make the changes that were necessary.
How long went by that you found yourself standing on a burning platform that you hadn’t created yourself?
I think a good part of a year. Probably 9 months. Because the results weren’t there. We were faced with a crisis right away - a massive recall of product. And that also contributed to me being gun-shy about enacting some of the changes because I did not have the confidence.
The importance of seeking support from others
The other thing that I often advise people on is you’ve got to seek the support of others who might be bringing the perspectives you need to finally make your move. And I did that at the time, probably later than I should. Everybody was very involved with solving the crisis, myself included. It was very easy to throw yourself at the crisis of today without thinking about preventing the crisis of tomorrow. The sense of urgency, the quick diagnostics, the urgency of making the changes and when your gut is not completely clear just seek others to help you clarify the view.
Others? That would be peers, and more senior people?
Yes. When I think about that experience, HR played a great role in advising me, and people that were very experienced in HR, senior leaders in HR, to help me frame the thinking:
What were the most critical roles on my team? How do I act on those first? Things like that. It just comes from experience.
Today I have an easier time doing these assessments and diagnostics, and moving to action, but that’s because I’ve done it dozens of times by now. The first time is always the hardest. I think that’s where I try to help others: to accelerate their thinking on acting faster.
Peak experiences - lessons learned
Sometimes we learn from mistakes, sometimes we learn from what went right. Can you think of a time that was a peak experience that taught you something about you and collaboration?
The last team I led at Mars was a peak experience for me because of the caliber. Again, it starts with that. Having the right caliber of folks in the right seats. I built possibly the highest caliber team that i have ever had which was the supply chain for a global small coffee business at Mars. We had all the diversity of thought and background that I could have asked for. These folks were extremely cognizant of the business needs and how we needed to transform our functions, supply chain, in order to support a growth trajectory. Our team became an enterprise cohort of thinking. How we could best connect our agenda in support of the business needs. It was very intertwined across as team members, and with the business. We transformed results at a pretty rapid pace even though the business ended up not growing the way we aspired it to. I think our function contributed exponentially to the profitability of that business. I looked at my direct reports as advisors. It was really a fantastic collaboration method that we created. I can’t even describe it as being intentional. I think the trick was to create a space recognizing that this group was highly talented. To create the space for their voices to make their way through the business. I think the more that space was obvious to them, the more confident they felt. We had the best discussions: frank, honest because there was space. And I felt like I was a facilitator, really, which was a great feeling.
Leading and weeding
So, facilitative leadership. Was there a person that wasn’t up to snuff that you had to act on and how did that work out?
That’s great that we’re going in that sequence because when I realized that there was one particular function that happened to be in procurement within that supply chain that was lacking the caliber. Within 45 days from taking the job, I acted on that function and even though it took me probably another 90 days to replace, that was where the learning comes and says there’s no sense in waiting. By making a move very swiftly you send a signal to the organization about the caliber you’re looking for, or the profile you don’t want to be a part of your team. And it pays dividends because naturally the organization steps up not only to help you, which was the case, to help me fill the gap, but also to embrace the new hire. The person I hired into that job turned out to be really, really successful at what he did till this day to Lavazza and is making great strides.
The dungeon experience - a learning opportunity from the trough
Now I want you to tell me about the worst experience you ever had. Is there a team experience you can look back on and the pain is still palpable?
I have a couple of memories of when being a team member was very painful. It was about not feeling valued and welcomed at the decision table, at the big kids’ table, which is super important because leadership is about making people feel valued and appreciated, and giving them the opportunity to keep learning and growing. It’s how you pass on the wisdom. How you articulate things in a way they can understand so they can take it and run with it, apply their own talents to it. How you recognize their contribution.
I was getting none. I was not getting the appreciation and the support. I was not getting much knowledge, I wasn’t learning much. So that combination can be fantastic to engage and retain, but the lack of it can be toxic, can disengage and lose talent.
If you don’t feel you’re valued or given the opportunity to grow…
And feel like your work matters. Everybody wants to feel they contribute. That’s very basic. Being respected and acknowledged for what they do. I think as a leader you’ll be cultivating a successful environment for people to thrive in.
Wise lessons to pay forward
What was the wisest thing anybody ever said to you about leading? Do you remember? I’m pretty sure that you went to some offsite program like the Center for Creative Leadership. What stuck with you?
There’s this idea, this nugget, kernel of an idea that the thing that gives the most value back to any endeavor is the people you leave behind when you’re no longer there. It’s not necessarily the dollars you saved or the factories you built or even the brands that you helped build. It’s the people that did it. You’re leaving those people in a position to pass that forward. You’re always passing forward a level of wisdom that prepares the next generation, and the next generation, that’s how things perpetuate.
To be the best possible leader you’ve got to teach. You’ve got to help people charge their path by being both generous with your time, with your knowledge, and your attention, And making people feel like they matter to the enterprise, to the agenda. I think those are very basic human traits that go back to respect and kindness and generosity. I think if you lead from that space, you’ll leave something behind. You’ll leave a mark that people will be able to build from in their own ways. It’s like you’re passing a torch with your little imprint on it, and it keeps going on and on. That’s how I think about it. It’s not about anything lofty or grand.
Oh, I think that’s pretty grand. What I think I heard you say was it’s people. They become your legacy.
Yeah, now that you said it, it sounds pretty grand. So thanks for putting a better word for it: legacy sums it up. The people you touch. How you help them. How you create opportunities for them. How you take risks on them. And how you help them move on when it’s not the right thing.
Managing separation with dignity and respect
Do you mean how you fire them?
-With dignity and the respect that they deserve. I think everything I’m saying boils down to very basic human relations elements.
What does a dignified separation sound like?
It’s one when you as the leader and the decision maker has put enough deep thought into the consequences and ramifications to the business and to the individual. When you get to a very solid place of conviction.
A conviction that this person is not the right fit, as we say?
Yes. And then how you translate that conviction into a positive thought pattern that this person would be better doing something else. They would be happier, more fulfilled. Once you gain that appreciation of the situation, I think you can extend that appreciation to the person.
Sometimes the person might embrace the thought right away and feel a sense of relief, sometimes they might make no connection with that angle and might still be frustrated or upset. But I think you’ve got to do that soul-searching yourself, and get to that confidence about your decision being the best for the person and for the business. Then project in every possible positive way how this move can enable other things for this person. If you do it in a genuine way, I think it can really help the person move on.
I’ve reflected on the times I’ve waited too long, and the times when I acted quickly, it’s one of the hardest things you’ll ever do as a leader.
Has it ever happened that you’ve had to separate or let somebody go and they’ve genuinely been grateful for how you handled it?
I think I can measure that by the instances in which I remained an active part of those people’s network. That frame of mind of doing it with dignity and helping the person move on was helpful and beneficial.
Advice for the rising new team leader
What’s the one piece of advice you would give me as a young, aspiring team leader?
That you peel away the layers of titles, experiences and levels, and think about people as that: think about them as human beings like you are with needs and fears and aspirations. When you boil it all down to that, it makes your role as leader a little simpler.
I’m reflecting on what you said about that team you led where you felt like they were your advisors. You were the boss, and they were like your cabinet. That had to be because you didn’t worry about whose title was what. It was just, “we have to get this done: who has the good ideas?”
Absolutely, yes. That’s exactly how I felt, and it was the best experience I had in leading that bunch.
Juliana Saretta, thank you so much for joining me on Teaming With Ideas.
Everyone take care.